>> Anonymous 12/20/20(Sun)23:39:07 No.119798304▶>>119798738 >>119800314 >>119802299 >>119803328 >>119804336 >>119804651 >>119806044 >>119797606 (OP) That's what bothered me, it's not some inconsequential thing, it's what kicks off the entire story. The reason why Flik had to leave the colony and found the main supporting cast, those circus bugs. The reason the grasshoppers elevated their threats. Toy Story had the same problem - Buzz Lightyear doesn't believe he's a toy. And yet Andy plays with him all the time because it's his favorite toy. If we got even one scene or even a few moments of Buzz reconciling that with is beliefs, it wouldn't have been nearly as distracting to think about. Hindsight is 20/20, sure, but I can just imagine it. >Woody tries to call out Buzz for the disconnect of him claiming to be a real space ranger when Andy plays with him >Buzz flips the script and asks how Woody feels when Andy plays with him >Woody describes how great it is >Buzz then agrees, annoyed, but trying to be diplomatic >"Andy plays with me because he believes in me! If he believes I'm a space ranger, why can't you? You don't seem to doubt that you're a cowboy!" >"Now wait just a second, hold - hold on! Andy's just pretending, he knows better!" Woody tries to clarify his position, but gives up - he knows Buzz got the upper hand in this one. >"What about RC? He drives like a car!" Mr. Potato Head shoots back. >"Yeah, and I hold coins, so what? I'm not a real piggy bank?" >"That is NOT what I meant, I - I...." Woody starts up again. >"Oh I think we know what you mean. You only want to be the favorite toy for your sake, not Andy's. If you ask me, it's hard to believe how you're ANYONE'S favorite toy." Mr. Potato rubs salt in the wound. >Woody, flustered, makes one last effort to come out on top, but the toys start to walk away. "Oh, come on! What? What? He used Andy against me, that's a cheap shot!" >> Anonymous 12/21/20(Mon)04:11:21 No.119800314▶>>119802395 File: Bob_tomatoe_thinking.gif (1.28 MB, 320x213) 1.28 MB >>119798304 Interesting. I never felt like Buzz Lightyear's viewpoint was hard to grasp. I felt like it is very obvious that Buzz believed he was a Space Ranger because everyone except Woody reinforced his world view (including Andy). If everyone says you are X, then you believe it. When Buzz is left alone with dolls for a small period of time his inner psychy adapts to become Mrs. Nesbit. >> Anonymous 12/21/20(Mon)07:11:58 No.119802299▶>>119803464 >>119798304 That still overlooks the most glaring issue of Toy Story: If Buzz thinks he's a real space ranger and not a toy, then his first instinct when presented with a human child ten times his size wouldn't be to "go limp", he'd fight and try to gain cover, and the jig would be up. And the movie even takes the one potential escape route, the one of "it's involuntary, toys do it without thinking" away in the entire scene with Sid: toys go limp and allow themselves to be played with voluntarily, and could easily walk and talk on their own with people around if they wanted. >> Anonymous 12/21/20(Mon)07:28:00 No.119802536▶>>119802689 >>119802759 >>119804697 >>119797606 (OP) Reminder that Toy Story was the only time Katzenberg was involved in a Pixar film, which is why it had more agressive characters and a more edgy sense of humor. The moment he left, they became a more cutesy and lighthearted company ( Incredibles was the only exception, but that's more of a Brad Bird film than a Pixar one ) >> Anonymous 12/21/20(Mon)07:36:48 No.119802689▶>>119802759 >>119802763 >>119802536 I'm amazed how casually edgy Incredibles was. I don't think any movie in the Disney catalog comes close to its grit. >> Anonymous 12/21/20(Mon)07:19:00 No.119802395▶>>119804238 >>119800314 Are you sure that wasn't from Buzz's crippling depression? >> Anonymous 12/21/20(Mon)09:10:35 No.119804238▶ File: EEE_plank.jpg (22 KB, 480x360) 22 KB >>119802395 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D5m33zK6ZlA [Embed] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDwcDGxjXtY [Embed] The depression more than anything. However I think Buzz is the kind of character that really relies on his extroverted natures when it comes to forming his identity. Buzz goes through an identity crisis of sorts, and adopts the first thing he sees (well the first thing he forced to be used as) because he can't cope with not being a space ranger. It's not until Woody comes back that he is able to snap Buzz out of his phase with the doll, but even then Buzz barely budges because of his lack of identity. >>119803464 I think it is instinctual, but they can break the rule if need be.